Notice Regarding Spotify Lossless Support

ROSE NOTICE
#105

Wilk
In your opinion, the EverSolo DMP-A10 may be a nicer device than the RS 151, but that doesn’t mean it is. Many people, including myself, would never buy the ES, which sounds poor, and I wouldn’t buy it even at 50% the price of the Rose.
In my country, the DMP-A10 sells very poorly, despite being cheap. The lower-end ES models sell well because they’re very inexpensive, so there are buyers for such “toys.”

Speaking of prices, it’s worth considering why Chinese products are so cheap. It’s because the Chinese government subsidizes audio and automotive companies for every device, car, etc., breaking the law that applies worldwide, where the government of a given country cannot subsidize products manufactured by private entities. That’s why their audio and car products are so cheap; no one can afford to release products at such low prices. But despite this, most people will not buy Ever Solo because the sound from these devices is weak and it is worth adding to the Rose RS 151 or even the Lumina P1 mini and buying much nicer sounding devices.
Ale te urządznia jak i auta nie będą wiecznie w takich cenach, przyjdzie pora , że i Chińczycy będą bardziej pazerni na kasę i zaczną ceny być wyższe. Nie stanie się to za rok, czy dwa, ale taki moment przyjdzie, tylko wtedy może być za późno na to, aby ratować audio i motoryzację itp. z Państw, które stosowały sie do przepisów obowiązujacych w “cywilizowanych” Państwach, gdzie prawo jest jasne, nie może Rząd danego Państwa dotować podmiotów prywatnych.

#106

“Many people, including myself, would never buy the ES, which sounds lousy, and I wouldn’t buy it even at 50% the price of the Rose.”

This is where actual testing comes into play, not just what I think. I actually did listening tests of the ES and Rose. I was convinced myself that the Rose was a dismal loser, both in terms of sound and functionality. The large screen alone won’t even out the disparity. And there’s an added bonus—the price.

2 Likes
#107

Cougar2025

1m

Far more people are buying EverSolos than do buy Rose and Lumin combined.

As for the sound, although there are also quite a few people convinced that magic crystals make a noticeable difference, fuses lift veils, or any other kind of idiocy, anyone with IQ above 75 or so realizes that any of them sounds the same on the most basic level (with EverSolo’s recent models having a significant edge in real world applications due to employing real engineers and adding proper sub integration and stuff).

People with IQ even below 50, of course, manage to misconfigure Dirac into clipping on one device, and then convince themselves that the other one sounds better, but that’s because people with IQ below 50 do all kinds of weird things.

2 Likes
#108

I agree with you here. The streaming ecosystem is no longer just about sophisticated technical devices, which accounts for 60% of success. The rest is software and a quick response to changing customer needs. In this respect, Rose is in non the lead. :joy:
Chinese companies have found their opportunity here, such as EverSolo, WiiM, and Topping. If they further improve the quality of their devices, plus support and low prices, they will dominate Definitely streaming market. :smiling_face_with_three_hearts:

#109

Wiim (LinkPlay) is actually American, and they still manage to design and sell well-performing devices at a very reasonable price.

I think 60% might be even too high – while there definitely is a subset of users who do believe that the price is the one and only indicator of quality and jump on every snake oil promise of “superior secret technology” they see, in the grand scheme of things they are a pretty small segment of the market. Not to say that they can’t keep a few companies afloat (after all Bybee, or Synergistic, or even something as expensive as Wadax have been in business for years and might outlive many “real” companies) – because most people just aren’t very bright – I would not be making any bets as to which companies do manage to latch to that segment successfully.

While there are some categories of devices (for example speakers) where you do have to pay reasonably good money to get noticeably better performance (and still, you could pay hundreds of thousands and get crap speakers, too), streamers and DACs themselves, once you move past Wiim pricing, aren’t ones. Distinguishing qualities are looks, build, and, most importantly for for the majority of people, features and software quality. Rose does pretty well on the former two, but on the latter ones even a Wiim or Node (very Canadian, so you can’t blame Chinese government for it) is lightyears ahead. And of course on the high end you have Lyngdorf, Trinnov, StormAudio and what not that do both the build and the software/features/knowing that we live in 21st century now much better…

2 Likes
#110

I have a Trinnov Altitude16 and I never see it mentioned as a premium 2ch DAC. It is outstanding as an AV processor for sure and I really enjoy listening to Dolby Atmos music through it as well as Auro 3D upmixing. I happen to think it is a very good 2 channel DAC, I just don’t have the golden ears to make such statements with authority. They did build their own DAC for what it’s worth.

1 Like
#111

They do make 2 channel equipment, too, both HiFi and studio-grade, although multichannel is their main thing.

#112

Wilk

I’ve written several times that I tested the Ever Solo in my own system and in two other systems with two friends. For each of us, the Ever Solo performed the worst, and no one bought the Ever Solo, even though it was the cheapest. As I wrote above, I wouldn’t buy this device even at 50% off.

#113

I’ve only tested the DMP-A10, their top-of-the-line model. And I still think it’s outstanding. :100: It requires specific settings, but it has a lot of different options. I won’t comment on the rest of the devices.

1 Like
#114

BorisM

Perhaps you’re seeing good sales of the Ever Solo in your country, because sales in Europe are poor, especially the top model, despite being significantly cheaper than the Rose and Lumin. In Europe, Lumin is very popular, and many people buy devices from this manufacturer. I’ve read on several audio forums, and about three people have Ever Solos, even the lower-end models, while there are many more who own Lumines and Roses, although the Lumin is more popular than the Rose.

I know of a case where a store clerk bought a top-of-the-line Ever Solo player for his father and listened to it for eight months. The device was put up for sale and sold after five months, after two price reductions. After the sale, Ever Solo bought a Lumin D3 and is much happier.

For example, a friend and I were selling a Rose RS 250. I sold it within ten days of posting the ad (I had my first buyer two days after posting the ad), and my friend sold it within three weeks of posting the ad. Both devices were about 3.5 years old. This is how it works in practice, and it’s also worth noting that if the Ever Solo had been manufactured in Korea, Europe, or Japan, the price of these devices would have been 20% higher, and sales would have been very poor. The Chinese government subsidizes its devices, and it does so illegally, but there’s no way around it because they do whatever they want.

#115

That just shows that people complain about Rose or Lumin much more. And of course if you look at the (rather small) subset of people who are buying devices to show off, rather than to listen to music, those people are buying Roses and Lumins if they are poor, or something really high-end if they are not. People who just want to listen to music are buying EverSolos – a quick look at any major retailer here shows that ES gets far more reviews (mostly 5 stars at that) while most Rose products show one or two reviews, if any.

Which is an entirely different argument and has nothing to do with ES products being far more technically advanced than Rose’s.

And your precious Lumin… it’s not exactly coming from the Free World either. It’s just as much of a Chinese brand, just being more into selling snake oil to audiophiles.

2 Likes
#116

“For example, my friend and I were selling a Rose RS 250. I sold it within ten days of posting the ad.” :face_with_monocle:

You can’t compare the RS151 with the RS250, they are two different levels of technology.

This is tangible proof that we’re talking about completely different devices. I’m referring to the top-of-the-line products from these manufacturers, i.e., comparing the RS151 with the DMP-A10. If we’re discussing on a forum, we should mention specific models (because only such comparisons make sense), not provide general judgments about a given brand. Every manufacturer has outstanding solutions in their portfolio, as well as small cost-effective solutions. :nerd_face:

#117

According to market analysis, sales in Europe are as follows:

Here is the detailed classification:

EverSolo (market leader in the group): The brand has achieved enormous success with the DMP-A6 and DMP-A8 models, often described as “hype.” EverSolo offers excellent value for money with modern touchscreens, very stable software, and excellent sound in the mid to high price range. According to reports, the company (part of Zidoo) exports approximately 80% of its products to Europe and America.
HiFi Rose: Considered a direct competitor to EverSolo, but often positioned in a higher price range and known for large displays and strong video functionality (e.g., YouTube app). They are very popular, but due to their higher price and software that is sometimes perceived as less intuitive, they are sold less frequently than EverSolo.
Lumin: An established high-end brand known for its very high sound quality. Lumin streamers are aimed at a more audiophile audience and are often more expensive than typical EverSolo models, resulting in lower sales volumes.

In summary:
EverSolo currently dominates the market for modern streamers in Europe in terms of price-performance ratio (€1,000–€2,000 range), while HiFi Rose and Lumin tend to occupy niches in the premium segment.

Mmhh…:man_shrugging:t2:

1 Like
#118

Bravo! :wave:
This is an analysis based on facts. :100:
That’s how we should be discussing things. Not reporting what we think is just a figment of our imagination.

1 Like
#119

The Eversolo has had a lot of great PR and reviews. So that they are selling more than the ROSE gear.
Also they started w lower priced gear and then introduced newer stuff w better components at higher prices.

Good reviews and strong word of mouth is a great way to market.
If you look at WiiM, they were doing good until they started to get negative reviews on YT.
There’s still a market for them… but right now Eversolo is on everyone’s Radar. (Until their products get too expensive and have parity w better gear.)

#120

It is quite possible that ES will lower the quality of their products to match “audiophile” drek, but why should they., they make money as it is.

It’s doubtful they were ever targeting the market for stupid people watching YT reviews. For people who do not get off on having spent $5000 for a power cable, they are a good choice and doing quite well.

2 Likes
#121

“Eversolo has garnered a ton of great reviews and PR, which is why it sells better than ROSE equipment.
They also started with cheaper equipment and then introduced newer models with better components at higher prices.”

Even the best reviews alone don’t influence buyers’ decisions. They’re more of an impulse for the average buyer (I’m ignoring the crazy ones), but they do trigger the process of checking, testing, etc. For me, the listening tests, combined with the demonstration of build quality, led to the decision to buy the DMP-A10. :smiling_face_with_three_hearts: This is already such a high level quality of technology that you can go higher for another 15,000 EUR quality. I’d rather spend that money on other pleasures.

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2 Likes
#122

I recently ‘decommissioned’ my RS130 and upgraded to the cheaper Eversolo T8.
I think the T8 is, in every useful way, much better than the RS130. It doesn’t have the heavy case work and large screen of the RS130, but in every other way it is an improvement!

1 Like
#123

BorisM

It’s significant that the Chinese government subsidizes its brands, because the rest of the world doesn’t, as it’s punishable in every country, from the US, through Japan, Korea, and even Europe. This allows the Chinese to put things into their devices and cars that Europe, for example, can’t afford, as it would increase the cost of the devices or cars. That’s why we now have a flood of Chinese cars in Europe at prices that European manufacturers can’t match.

When it comes to devices, I had the Ever Solo, a top-of-the-line streaming player, and even at 50% of the original price, I wouldn’t have bought it because the sound is poor and the top-of-the-line streamer from this manufacturer sells poorly. Anyone with a serious streaming career won’t buy the Ever Solo; I don’t know anyone with good systems who owns the Ever Solo. It’s like buying a Mercedes, say, a C-Class with a three-cylinder engine. Nevertheless, if the Ever Solo suits you, I suggest buying one and you’ll be happy. I don’t know what streamer you have yet, but you’re constantly complaining about the Rose. If I’m not interested in the Ever Solo, I don’t visit the manufacturer’s forum and complain about how weak it is, because I don’t see the point. If I don’t like it, I don’t come here and complain.

It’s going to be a long time before the Ever Solo will be as good sonically as, for example, Lumin, Aurender, Esoteric, Matrix, DCS, or Rose, and it will take a long time for people with good systems to decide to buy devices from this manufacturer. Europe is a good example of what people like to listen to, and it’s definitely not the Ever Solo.

1 Like
#124

You would be surprised on how much influence the YT reviews have.

You said you bought based on listening tests. Ok, so what led you to look at the Eversolo in the first place? :wink: