We are not talking about ADDING ANYTHING to the mix Boris, we’re talking about taking Roon out of the mix.Have you tried it?Please let us know what your ears tell you.Respectfully,Jay
You don’t know what you’re missing!
You don’t really need to double down on letting everyone know that you have absolutely no clue how things work.
Have you ever tried painting polka dots on your streamer. I’m telling you, it lifts veils so high, even the wife in the kitchen drops the frying pan!!!
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Yes, I did, and no, you are neither adding nor subtracting anything from the mix, as long as all the settings are correct.
Laws of physics do not care for your golden ears.
Ironically, that alleged SQ improvement from Innuos software has been discussed much, including on Roon forums, and turned into a big embarrassment for Innuos. Not that Innuos weren’t an embarrassment to begin with…
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We understand how it is supposed to work. Unfortunately that is not how it sounds.
Could be Rose’s implementation of the Roon network endpoint. Who knows what their software is doing.
Only thing I do know, is that it sounds different, and it shouldn’t.
Boris, if you wont even test it, your bias and fear of being wrong just makes you look like a fool. You attack everyone in every post you respond to. If you did not design the Hifi Rose products in the hardware or software domain, you cannot claim to know the physics of the device. Measure it and show us your results if you’re so sure.
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Gentlemen, I assure you, there is no difference where the digital signal comes from — it goes straight to the digital-to-analog processor of your ROSE, and that’s where all the magic happens before reaching your golden ears. Whether it’s via ROON or the ROSE app with QOBUZ, the sound will be identical in 100% of cases. With your posts, you’re only discrediting yourselves.
There is no magic in the design of the HIFI ROSE streamer — they are all built on the SAME principle. And if there are any “SPECIAL SOUND SETTINGS,” they only come into play, or can only have an effect, after the signal has been converted to analog. So what difference does it make whether the signal comes from ROON or the QOBUZ ROSE app? The result will be exactly the same!
So, you tried it then?
I should be able to find time to try this soon. Long time Roon user with RS130 RD160 combo with Qobuz as my main streaming option. On first listen, it sounds like Qobuz app through the RS130 is a little louder so I’ll have to factor that in.
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I can’t say I hear any difference when listening to a couple of tracks I know very well. I have all settings in Muse on Roon disabled and am listening to Quobuz tracks on the Roon app and the Rose app. I’ll play some more, but feel free to describe which tracks you hear a clear difference and I can try those. I do have a highly resolving system FYI.
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Cool, thanks for testing. I was testing with a couple Sohn tracks from the Tremors album. It could very well be that its a slight increase in volume. I’m trying to think of a scientific way to test this. I suppose I could record the analog output from the RD160 in both scenarios and do a diff on the recorded audio.
Or, far more likely (the only likely thing, really) it sounds exactly the same, once accounted for volume et al, but some people can’t let go of the idea that their ears are particularly golden.
Nope. I heard it, it’s not difficult to run the same track through Qobuz directly, and through Roon. Of course there is no difference.
Insisting on there being some where there can’t be is no different from people insisting that special fuses change the sound.
You… don’t know what physics means, do you?
Assembling a streamer, from purely off the shelf parts at that, does not produce any kind of special new physics. Or math.
And yes, you could run RD60’s output into Deltawave and compare them. 160 being a very mediocre DAC handicaps you right there, but it should be at least consistent enough to show that feeding the same DAC with same bits produces same electric impulses.
Thanks for testing Boris. We were only looking for opinions from people who actually tried it. Not hearing a difference is valid.
Are you using the Rose app to try Quobuz alone I assume? We should make sure that is the case (or some other way) so we are comparing apples and apples.
Yes, Rose app with Qobuz, and then Roon with Qobuz (with volume leveling off as well as Muse off).
Hi everyone that have discerning ears.One thing is certain,We have audiophiles that trust their ears and gear and we have electrical engineers/astrophysicists/genius ones🙄
I think that saying you/I hear a difference is about as scientific as saying it is impossible to hear a difference without even listening to it. Having a discussion about it doesn’t need to be so aggressive.
Also want to say that even if the difference is a slight volume/gain difference, that is still a legitimate difference, and shouldn’t be the case if there is “no difference”.
I will attempt to make a scientific measurement to put this debate to bed.
Please factor in loudness at least with measuring it.Does anyone know how Muse really works by the way?One thing I forgot to add was how much of the bass content felt suffocated,giving it a less lively sound.I really appreciate you getting involved Carnelian and would like to know more about your resolving system.All the best in sound to all!
I’ll have some more time Saturday to listen for differences. Muse is just DSP within Roon as far as I’m aware.
The digital side of my system is fiber into the house, Sonore OpticalModule Deluxe for SFP, fiber to RS130, fiber to RD160, balanced XLR to Zesto Leto Ultra II preamp, RCA to Yamamoto A-011 2A3 amplifier running EML tubes, and Coherent Audio 15 Platinum NeoBe speakers which are coaxial like Tannoys using Radian drivers.
Jay, I have a test for you. Go to Muse, under Speaker Setup, and add 0.38db of gain to both speakers and A/B against Rose. Tell me if they sound closer, if not the same now.
Well, honestly, would you demand that people test whether painting the Rose electric green makes SQ difference, too?
“Trust their ears” generally means “extremely gullible” and lacking in any kind of education… 
That is a valid (and somewhat common) difference. Once that is controlled for though (some manufacturers really want their preferred software to “sound better”) those vast and wifehearditfromtrhekitchen differences miraculously disappear.
That said, at some point entertaining the idea that you do need to test fuses, external clocks, audiophile switches, fidelizers, and differences in bitperfect software playback just servers to encourage either outright crooks (like cable peddlers) or ignorance of people who enable them.