Seriously Considering RS130 purchase; have questions

ROSE Products RS130
#1

I’m seriously considering this streamer. Have never owned a streamer and am mainly concerned about sound quality. Currently only streaming on my upstairs 2nd system of video/audio(Spotify) via Apple TV + ethernet wired to my router. I would use the RS130 in my main system downstairs and have all the hardware purchased I need in order to run fiber from my router to the listening room. I have 2 DAC options: a DAC card in my linestage and Lynx HILO. Currently I use the SPDIF out from my CD transport to the SPDIF input of the linestage DAC card. I could use the RS130 USB out to either the USB linestage DAC card input or the USB input on the HILO. I’ve extensively compared Mconnect to ROON in a friend’s system and Mconnect wins every time for sonics. Yes, ROON is user friendly and works well. Will I be able to use Mconnect at all in conjunction with the RS130? I could use either a Mac mini downstairs or a Windows version 10 upstairs computer as a ROON core.

Will I be able to stream music from a hard drive connected to the RS130 or use TIDAL/Quobuz on the RS130 back to my upstairs system instead of using Spotify on the Apple TV? I don’t have video downstairs, only 2 channel audio, so using video streaming downstairs is not an issue for me. I’m currently happy with the video streaming on the Apple TV upstairs.

Now to concerns. I’ve read in this community complaints about buggy apps/software and spotty support. I’d be very interested in feedback on these issues.

Thanks in advance for all your suggestions, advice, comments, opinions, etc.,

#2

Software is somewhat buggy, yes, and depending on how you are planning to use it, it may or may not be an issue. With Roon it works pretty well, if you want to manage the music with Rose itself, not so much.

As for the other questions, RS130 is a transport. It does not have any sound whatsoever, and would not be any different from using e.g. RS250 (which gives you a perfectly fine DAC for less money) with an external DAC.

Unless you are doing some signal processing in either mConnect or Roon, there can’t (and aren’t) any sonic differences between the two. DAC gets exact same bits.

RS130 is an end-point, not a server, so it won’t stream anything to external devices. You could install a disk into it and play from it on an external device by connecting to it as a regular file share, but that’s not really the optimal way of using it.

#3

I don‘t agree with Boris.

I have compared and owned many different digital tranports (streamers without embedded DAC) and there ARE sonic differences between digital transports. I can’t explain exactly what are the technical reasons (a lot is written about jitter and timing controlled by clocks), but I am listening to HiFi gear since 45 years and trust my ears. There ARE sonic differences! Regarding to Boris every well done digital transport sounds the same, price doesn’t matter. Really? All HiFi enthusiasts out there are so silly to spend thousands of dollars for a digital transport if a few hundreds of dollars does the same job soundwise. Just to show other people they can afford? Make your own decision or better - hear different digital transporter, compare the sound and judge yourself.

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#4

No. In sighted tests, your (or mine, or his) ears can be trusted only as far as you can throw an “audiophile directional CAT7 ethernet cable.”

Really. If you can show otherwise, in a blind test (not “ah been listening for years, ah trust muh ears!”) run, don’t walk to AES, Nobel Committee, and everywhere else where they give out prizes for upending all of modern science.

Yes. We are talking people buying green CD markers, putting cables on little elevators, and replacing power cables (after miles of whatever wire the power company strung on poles). There are people who believe that the Earth is flat, too.

One does not need to keep counting every day to confirm that 2+2=4, but if you want to, you can certainly test it, just make sure that you do not see which transport is playing. If you manage to hear a difference, see above and send a paper to AES. It would be great news to them.

#5

Ok, Boris - there are 99% idiots out there and 1% (or one) Boris …🫣… sorry Boris, but this is too much black or white thinking for me.

#6

You’d be surprised how many idiots are out there…

Hear some difference in a blind test, then we can talk. Until then you are just arguing about voices in your head.

#7

I will chime in. Not all streamers sound the same. The rose130 is great sounding and I preferred it over the Innuos zenith mk2 with a usb Phoenix and over an aurender model, I think an N100. I have found the app to work well and the unit does respond to power cable and interconnect changes/upgrades.

Like all things audio, let your ears and experience dictate the best decision for you.

#8

I agree with Kislekt1. The RS130 is a great sounding unit, I have not had any problems with the software playing files from a NAS via fiber. I do prefer the sound using the RS130 + RSA720 connecting to a Chord Hugo TT2.

#9

I am selling mine, less than a week old if you’re interested.

#10

They do, actually, unless one is broken. What they do NOT do is “respond to power cable changes.”

People who will compare, sighted, things that make no difference, and convince themselves that there were a “night and day” improvement are rather amusing, in a pathetic way.

#11

Always great to see someone troll a forum when people are just trying to have a civil discussion.

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#12

Must be a tough life when reality “trolls” you every day…

#13

Hi Boris, are you suggesting that 2 streamers made by different companies with different parts and each with a different design will sound exactly the same?

#14

If both streamers are connected to the same DAC with a same connection, and neither of the streamers is doing any resampling or DSP, and neither of them is so badly made that it puts so much noise in audio frequency range that it passes through to the DAC’s analog output (although if it does, you really need a better DAC), then 1) with a USB connection they will produce the same analog output from a DAC (I would not say “sound” because there is nothing analog in a pure streamer, so there is no sound produced there) and 2) if connected with S/PDIF or I2S, they will sound the same as long as the clock in one of them isn’t atrociously bad. And by atrocious I mean really atrocious; I am not aware of any real modern product with a clock that bad. There probably are some (most likely very expensive, too) but I haven’t seen one in ages.

#15

I’ll take that to mean “Yes” :slight_smile:
Peace

#16

Be my guest :slight_smile:

I’ll give a box of beer to anyone who can tell 130, 150, and 250 apart, when used as transports, without looking…

#17

Hi @allvinyl, John,
I don’t agree with Boris either. In my audiophile journey, I have discovered that hearing differences is related to overall quality of the system as a whole. There was a time when I couldn’t hear differences in USB cables. And I thought this was as it should be. But then there came a time when with an upgraded preamp and amp, etc., it became clearly evident that there are differences. (to my dismay) Anyway, I will attest that the RS130 is the best sounding source I have heard. I previously had a Playback
Designs server upgraded with Windows Server OS & system optimization software such as Windows Debloat and Fidelizer. The RS130 blew it away! Although, I will say that it didn’t happen until there were over 500 hours on the RS130. Currently, my system consists of the RS130 as source, a Playback Designs MPD-8 DAC ($24K), an Aric Audio MLII 6SN7 preamp, Aric Audio Super 300B amp, and Vaughn Barbera II speakers with Dukane plasma tweeters. The RS130 has some quirks with software, such as playlist operation, Native DSD playback with some DACS, etc. Mine is one of those. It is because of the fact that Rose uses such an old Linux/Android kernel, which support has admitted. BUT, I don’t mind a few quirks of that sort. The sonic quality of playback is unsurpassed in my experience! This is what is most important to me. So, despite the software quirks, I kept mine. In the end, it is what I hear that matters. A little inconvenience is tolerable. Nothing perfect in this world.

Best wishes,
Michael

P.S. Boris, I respect your position and I used to have a similar perspective. But time and experience have proven me wrong. Blind A/B tests have been shown to be invalid. And believe me, I have done my fair share. In a blind A/B test, when the music is switched back and forth in a short period of time, I can’t tell the difference sometimes… BUT, if I listen for an extended period and then switch a component or cable, etc., then it becomes clearly obvious. Just my opinion, but I think our brain/ear operation is more advanced than the most educated scientist understands. And I don’t think we have tests sophisticated enough to show the actual differences. You are certainly welcome to have your opinion, but what one person’s perception compared to another’s cannot be compared unless you can be in that person’s head! Let people have their own experience. It’s OK!

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#18

No, they weren’t.

No, it does not. Scientists actually do understand this part of psychoacoustics well enough. It has been shown, proven, and demonstrated many times, very reliably, that people will hear whatever they want to hear, whether there are any differences or not. And (no offence to anyone) people with little knowledge of the subject matter (USB cabkes… Fidelizer… it literally does nothing…) do very much want to “prove” that their golden ears are more sensitive than any lab instrument, and that of course they understand how thing work much better than those stupid eggheads who designed them.

And of course nobody wants to admit that they had spend $24K on a DAC that is less accurate than a one for $1000.

Hear a difference btween 130 and a 250, with or without burn-in (lol) wither in short-term proper AB test or long-term audiophile BS “extended listening” one, as long as you can not see which one it is and you get a box of Belgian beer of your choice :slight_smile:

#19

Hello again @allvinyl.
I will reiterate, the sound quality of the RS130 is the best sounding source component my ears have heard. It does need a long burn-in time though.

Your thread has been somewhat hijacked. I apologize for my part in it, but this will be my last word on the subject of whether people can hear changes between components, cables or the like. I can, and many others can as well. Some can’t. To settle this debate once and for all… to put a period on it, I will relate an experience…

I have a friend who is an electrical engineer. He is retired now but worked for Hewlett Packard. Anyway, early on in my audiophile journey, we had a casual conversation one day about me hearing differences in speaker cables. I asked him why that might be. He claimed that it is impossible for there to be differences given the wire has sufficient gauge. I disagreed. So, I suggested that we do a blind A-B-C-D test. A, B, & C being different cables and D being no change. Like I said before, I have done them. My system at the time was an Audio Research preamp and amp and the speakers were Klipsch Klipschorns (corner horns). The speaker cables involved were Kimber 8TC, Monster & a custom cable I built myself. I built a switching device with the three sets of speaker cables attached. All three ran from the amp to the switch and then to the speakers. Then I invited him over. I asked him to sit in front of me with his back turned to me and switch the cables as he desired as the music played. To further enhance the “blind” part, I closed my eyes. Sometimes he switched and sometimes he didn’t, trying to trick me. Each time he asked me which cable was engaged, I correctly identified it. He was flabbergasted. One, that I could correctly identify the cable each time but also because he couldn’t hear any difference. This proved to my satisfaction that there are indeed differences that can be heard and also that some people have more sensitive hearing than others. This is the reality. Someone may throw insults and mock others that experience things differently than he does. He may make bold claims that this or that is proven in an attempt to bully others into believing as he does. But no matter how rudely or loudly a person shouts, that doesn’t make it true. People perceive things differently. Some see more color, some less. Some see more clearly, some less. We could go on and on with these comparisons. But hearing is no different. Some hear more detail, some less. Some are sensitive to high frequencies that hurt their ears while someone else thinks it sounds perfect, etc. People experience things differently. Accept it or not. But…

We have an amazing hobby. Music is so powerful. It stirs our emotions to extraordinary heights, puts smiles on our faces or turns on the tears. It is a gift! Please, let’s enjoy it and allow others to enjoy it, even if their experience is different than ours. Let’s be kind and tolerant!

And for those of us who do and are, we just have to ignore those that don’t and aren’t.

Best wishes to all,
Michael

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#20

ABX testing in audio is absurd, in spite of what the “Church of Floyd Toole” has to say.

If you are convinced that you can’t hear a difference between the RS130 and the RS250 streaming to the same DAC (or if you only recognize a difference that can be heard in a DBT) then you are deaf.